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Mr. BONKER. Was this a prepared statement?

Mr. BUCHANAN. Yes. And someone in the middle bureaucracy had taken it upon himself to strike from my statement something on which I had received assurances in advance, that I could include in my statement before I left Washington. Fortunately, I was able to raise these issues in other ways.

I really think that there is a need for a high-level review, and perhaps by your committee, as well as the highest level at the State Department, of the handling of routine questions and take some of that decisionmaking power out of the hands of, or at least better define it for, the middle-level bureaucracy of the State Department.

Mr. BONKER. It seems to me that the congressional delegate to the Commission ought to be sufficiently informed of our human rights policies in general, and have the confidence and support of the State Department. He is capable of exercising discretion, not only in substantive matters, but in a whole range of procedural matters that come up.

If he is not given free rein, it is going to be very difficult for him to be effective within the Commission, because when you are trying to develop a consensus of the other Western allies, and he is intimidated by what may or may not be coming from the State Department, I can see where his efforts to be a leader within the Commission are inhibited.

Mr. BUCHANAN. On the matter of the specific illustration which I gave, which might not have been the best illustration because you have a question mark about our policy, we do not support an all-out economic boycott against South Africa. Certainly it would seem more in line with our policy for us not to be identified with commending one government for imposing such a boycott.

What troubled me about it was the insistence that we block the consensus and then we had to move on to be the only nation to vote "no," where most other Western nations were simply abstaining, which, in their cases, did not endorse the embargo. And it was the isolation, it was the delegation being forced to take a position in isolation that troubled me and has troubled me ever since I have had any personal involvement in the U.N. system.

Mr. BONKER. Regardless of who the delegate is, this is a continuing problem?

Mr. BUCHANAN. Absolutely. So all the time I was at the U.N. General Assembly, I cringed at our African positions, particularly on that point. They have improved a little since, not very much, but we would, over and over again, in my judgment, unnecessarily isolate ourselves, both with the strength of our statements on small matters and with insisting on negative votes when our other Western friends were abstaining without endorsing necessarily what was happening.

When we do this in areas that are of such central importance to the developing countries, they are such sensitive matters as far as all the Africans are concerned, it makes it doubly hard for us to prove our concern for their rights and for us to win their support in those matters that may be of importance to our country.

Again, I would say the nitpicking on budget matters is another area like that. That Department of State is, for some reason, frightened to death of the Congress when it comes to any money matter and feels

it to be an obligation to nitpick on every single spending item that comes along.

I think for the wealthiest country that has ever existed in the history of the world, it makes such a limited total investment in these things, although it may be making the largest. By our standards, it just seems to me that we unnecessarily put ourselves right with the Russians into the role of the bad guy with the black hat rather than being the superpower who is the good guy with the white hat.

Mr. BONKER. When you referred to the nitpicking on expenditures, this does refer to the State Department's reluctance to help finance a U.N. Commissioner?

Mr. BUCHANAN. Of course, we support that idea, but we nitpick on so many other budget items. I was contrasting the fact that we are supporting the U.N. Commissioner on Human Rights, which means more budget, with the fact that we tend to nitpick on other, smaller budget items.

Mr. BONKER. There must be a former Congressman involved if we are doing that kind of nitpicking.

Mr. BUCHANAN. I think, Mr. Chairman, the United States is in a position to give leadership to the U.N. system. I think there is every reason that we can give leadership. I think the slight change of attitude and posture and review of all of our policies, the decision to abstain sometimes rather than isolate ourselves, the decision to be somewhat more positive and nitpick a little bit less, the decision to aggressively work with the leadership people like Mr. Mezvinsky and others, and to be a force within the U.N. system, I think we can succeed. I think we may need to make some changes in order to maximize that opportunity.

Mr. BONKER. John, since 1977-78 when the United States raised the concern of human rights to the level that it has, and we have attempted to implement human rights policies in various ways, is the expectation level of other countries and the potential for being in contradictory positions with respect to our human rights policy, causing us something of a problem in exercising that leadership? Do you think since we have raised this issue on such a worldwide basis, that people find it convenient to politicize our human rights policy to their own convenience?

Mr. BUCHANAN. Yes, Mr. Chairman. I would agree. I would say again that I would hope that we would have your review and review at the highest levels of the administration of the implications of human rights being an essential plank of our foreign policy, as the President, the Secretary of State, Mr. Mezvinsky and others have reiterated that we review the implications of that even in the smaller matters as well as the large matters in such areas as human rights. Mr. BONKER. Your statement implies that we are really not exercising our leadership within the Commission, that our participation is negative, and that our delegate does not have sufficient authority to act. I am wondering whether, despite our image of being a leader in this field, if we really are being effective within the Commission?

Mr. BUCHANAN. I would say, Mr. Chairman, in my judgment it is like having a very fine eight-cylinder car operating on two cylinders, and needing something of an overhaul. We are giving some leadership.

Mr. BONKER. Do you think if we make the delegate an official Ambassador that that would add a few cylinders?

Mr. BUCHANAN. Yes, indeed, I do think so.

Mr. BONKER. Thank you so much, Congressman Buchanan, for your appearance and testimony today.

Mr. BUCHANAN. Thank you.

Mr. BONKER. I appreciate your continuing interest in human rights policy.

Ambassador Mezvinsky-we might as well promote you-I welcome you to the subcommittee as a former member and as our official delegate to the U.N. Commission on Human Rights, and I understand that Mr. Warren Hewitt, Director of the Office of Human Rights, Bureau of International Organizations, Department of State, is accompanying you. We have a good beginning and, Mr. Mezvinsky, if you dant to continue either with your formal statement or informal report, you may proceed at your own pleasure.


Mr. MEZVINSKY. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

If I may I would like to submit the statement for the record and quickly summarize it. Then we can go on to some of the points that were raised by Congressman Buchanan and then answer whatever questions you have.

First I would like to say that I welcome the opportunity to be here. I am glad that this subcommittee is still in existence. There was some question at one time, but fortunately it is still in existence and fortunately the oversight role that you mentioned at the very beginning is there and it can be very helpful to our efforts.

Now, before going into the comments by Congressman Buchanan, I might quickly say that I welcome those comments. He, as well as Members of Congress, play a very key role in this whole issue, let alone the Human Rights Commission, and I was pleased that he mentioned that it was a good idea to have Members of Congress and public members as a part.

I think that what he was saying in terms of the problems I will defer until I give a quick summary of what really happened at the Commission and then quickly get back to that.

We see a Human Rights Commission that is involved with 32 member countries. They come from respected parts of the world. The forum is a forum that is devoted toward human rights. It is a Commission that is the key organization in the field of human rights for the United Nations. Its basic thrust, at least our position has been, that it should function as effectively as possible and try to avoid focusing on a few countries and begin to broaden the perspective, and that is the hope that comes from, as you point out, the Universal Declaration on Human Rights which is the implementing arm. It comes from the Charter. It comes from the covenants that the President signs. It comes from other agreements that we still have pending before the U.S. Congress in the Senate.

That is the background. What happened at this particular session?

Briefly, what happened at this session was that there were many items on the agenda. The items cover everything from the drafting of international instruments, such as the Torture Convention. A beginning was made on that, I think a very significant beginning, and we can try hopefully to complete that instrument within the next year, or certainly by the next Commission. We had another issue, the declaration on religious intolerance. There are many groups in this country, domestically as well as throughout the world, which have been with us many years and very little action has been taken in the past. This year, for the first time, three articles were approved over objections from Eastern Europe and others which were, in principle, against the whole concept of the declaration on religious intolerance.

We heard, as Congressman Buchanan pointed out, a discussion about the confidential procedures involving certain countries. Action was taken on 10 countries.

A country I know you are interested in in terms of your visit in the past, Ethiopia, Equatorial Guinea, Uganda, Paraguay, Uruguay, Bolivia, Burma, Indonesia, South Korea.

Mr. BONKER. Let the record show that I was only in one of those countries.

Mr. MEZVINSKY. One country you were traveling in, and only country. Let the record make that clear.

So for the first time this year, there was over a week of discussion where particular countries had to answer, in confidential session, complaints about a consistent pattern of gross violations within the country. That, I think, in some ways was unprecedented when you see a country actually come in and have to answer the questions. There are some people, and we can go into whether that confidential procedure is totally effective, doing its job, but at least the process has begun.

In one case, Equatorial Guinea, that country did not cooperate under the confidential procedures and, as a result, was forced to face a public condemnation that took place at this Commission.

Mr. BONKER. When you say "public condemnation," resolution or disapproval?

Mr. MEZVINSKY. A public resolution against Equitorial Guinea specifically for its violations of human rights and for its lack of coopera


Mr. BONKER. What was the vote on that?

Mr. MEZVINSKY. The vote on that, the total vote, I think there wasdo you remember the exact vote, Warren? The vote was overwhelmingly in support of the resolution. I think there was a small, handful of countries, basically Eastern European, I think, and two other countries, Syria and Iraq, that voted against that proposition, but most Third World countries western delegations-as far as the African countries, Senegal, Nigeria, Egypt, joined in that.

For the record, we will give you the total vote. [The information follows:]

The vote was as follows: 20 in favor, 3 against (U.S.S.R., Poland, Bulgaria), and 9 abstentions.

Mr. BONKER. The resolution was based on human rights violations, but prompted because they did not send a representative to respond to the charges?

Mr. MEZVINSKY. They did not send a representative. They also did not, in accordance with the action taken by the Human Rights Commission the previous year, respond in a manner that showed that they would cooperate, let alone that the response was satisfactory, that they were trying to be at all responsive toward the questions of human rights or violations.

Mr. BONKER. Was that the only country that did not show up that was requested to in this procedure?

Mr. MEZVINSKY. There were other countries that did not, unfortunately. I will be glad to supply for the record in writing the proceedings of who did and who did not respond, but since it is a confidential procedure, I am not at liberty to go into the exact specifics, but I will be glad to supply that to the subcommittee.

[The information follows:]

The Commission considered situations concerning 10 countries under its confidential procedures. Of the 10 countries, all but two were represented during the Commission's discussions of their respective country situations.

Mr. BONKER. Did Uganda show up?

Mr. MEZVINSKY. The answer is yes, they showed up, and they are a member of the Commission, so it is rather difficult for them not to show up if they are a member of the Commission. Yes, they did show up.

I see the vote was 20 votes in favor, 3 against, with 9 abstensions, so when I gave the breakdown of the numbers, most of the people who did not go along with it abstained.

In addition to that action on the confidential procedure, there was discussion and we made a public statement. We mentioned the Helsinki monitors, we mentioned the 22 Soviet monitors, which had never been done before in terms of public session.

We also talked about an area of congressional concern. That was a matter regarding the history of genocide and specifically the massacre of the Armenians. A number of delegations spoke on that matter, and the United States did, as well.

Now, on the negative side, we should point out that there was no action taken on missing persons, although there was action on Chile, but not on the overall problem of missing persons which we felt should have been taken, but the Commission did not, basically because Third World countries felt that it should be postponed.

Another matter that there was no action taken on this year was Cambodia. Another area that did not receive the focus of attention that we would have hoped it would have, would have been the problem of the causes of refugees, the mass exodus of refugees.

So we have those negative factors, coupled with the issues that I mentioned at the beginning, and one other factor. Since you mentioned the reform, or the restructuring of the U.N., there is a move now for taking the Human Rights Commission and beginning to expand it, not only in terms of numbers, but longer meetings, two sessions of which President Carter talked about and begin to give it the focus of attention that it deserves.

With that, let me just raise a very brief point about the politicization of the Commission and the double standard. It is true that it is much easier to draft instruments, but when you have to implement

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