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from Political clubs. He would tell the hon. Member what sort of a Parliament had been within a short time back constituted at Naples under the government of these Political clubs. He was there himself at the time, and he could speak positively as to the fact. There was a legis-dured. lative body in existence, every member of which was threatened by Carbonari Clubs if he did not speak and act in a certain way. He repeated, that he hoped he should never see the time when this country would be governed by Political Unions. Sir Francis Burdett said, that after the observations just made by the hon. Baronet, he could not abstain from saying a few words on the subject. He was not aware that these Political Unions were either illegal, or unconstitutional, or improper. He said this, because he was himself a member of a Political Union, and he did not think that he was laying himself open to any censure on that account. He thought that, instead of being improper, they were both justifiable and necessary: that it was absolutely necessary for the people of England to show their determination to obtain a remedy for that scanda-ests of all men were consulted; in which lous state of corruption which existed in men of property were conciliated, because the system of the election of Members of the value of their property was for the first that House; and which, until within these time considered in the system of Reprefew late years, no man had ever ventured sentation, and in which all men saw a to have the face to say was defensible in probability of enjoying the elective franany point whatever. Who, he would ask, chise, and of exercising it freely and had been the occasion of these Political honestly; such a measure, though it might Unions? They had arisen out of the per- not satisfy every one man in the country, petual denials of that House to give the would at least satisfy all men of moderapeople their due share in what was called tion, and all such men were united in its the representation of the people. That support-but when an honest Administrawas the cause of these evils, if evils they tion, for the first time in the history of were; and evils, in one respect, he ad- Government, had come forward with a mitted them to be; but they were attri-remedial measure of that sort, and debutable entirely to such persons as the manded support from the people of Enghon. Baronet, and those who supported land, it was most provoking-so provoking him. The present Ministry had brought that it was difficult to keep language in this Bill to prevent the necessity of the within the limits of the rules of that House, people taking steps of such a nature, and difficult to keep it within the bounds of their object had been most unhappily de- decency and propriety, it was, he repeated, feated. But as the people were disap- most provoking, the king having nobly set pointed in their just expectations, were himself at the head of the Reformers, they to be kept from expressing their dis- and a whole people supporting the Reform, satisfaction? If the language they used that a few persons should be found directly was thought too strong, he could not but opposed to it, and that, when it was rejectsay that he thought it, under all the cir-ed, those persons should expect that all the cumstances, very excusable; and that world would bow and bend to their will, those who by their conduct had occasioned and consent quietly, at their good pleasure, that language to be used, were the last to give up all hope of what every honest who ought to find fault with it. Ever man was convinced was necessary for the since he had known his countrymen, he prosperity and happiness of the country.

believed it had always been considered their right freely to express their opinions on the whole or any branch of the Legislature. Yet now the doctrine was put forward in that House, that strong language from the people was not to be there enHe said, on the contrary, that such a doctrine was not to be endured. The attempt to stifle the free expression of just complaints would promote all the evils which they affected to dread. Hon. Gentlemen complained of Political clubs indeed: why, had not these very Gentlemen established clubs of all kinds? They governed Ireland for years by Orange clubs. How long, too, was it thought an honour to belong to Brunswick clubs? and when the people at length insisted on a measure of Reform, and the Ministry had the honesty to bring a measure of Reform before the public, whether it met the wishes of every one man in the country he would not venture to say; and there was no man in his senses who would expect, as the hon. member for Preston seemed to do, that it should meet the wishes of all; it was at least a measure in which the inter

He defied the Government to go on without | adoption could only be secured by the adopting such a measure. Suppose the people giving their full support to those Ministers had been silly enough to shrink Ministers who had so well deserved it by from their duty to a most brave and gene- proposing such a measure for parliamentary rous Sovereign-to shrink from their duty adoption. Let them, then, give their conto the public-suppose they had done this, fidence to the Ministry-let them show then, even then, he would ask, if they that they were convinced, as he was, that threw up the reins of government, who the Ministers would not abandon the duty would venture to take the conduct of the they owed to their Sovereign and to the Government except upon the basis of this people. At the same time he was certain measure of Reform? It came then to that whatever steps were adopted by perthis, that the opposition to this measure sons out of the House, they were adopted, was a factious opposition-an opposition not with a view to dictate to the Ministry, for the purpose of turning out the Adminis- but to shew the Ministry that they ought tration. He was the more convinced of not to shrink from completing the great this when he saw those Gentlemen who work they had begun, and to prove to began with opposing all attempts at Re- them and to their opponents that there form admit, at last, that Reform was neces- was nothing likely to throw the country sary, while they threw in the way of every into confusion but the rejection of this species of Reform all sorts of obstacle, and measure. Every one, however, was contried to veil their real opposition to Reform vinced that the measure could not be under an affected opposition to this par- finally rejected; but every one was also ticular measure. Why, even the Duke of convinced, that to enable the Ministers to Wellington himself now admitted that carry it, the people must zealously give some Reform was necessary. A short time them their support. The people were well since it was not so with the noble Duke, inclined to do so, for they felt how much and the world gave him credit at least for they were indebted to the present Mimanliness and courage when he made the nisters, and that their interests required declaration. But even he had been com- them to give Ministers their support; for pelled to recede from the point of absolute they knew that the country would never refusal of Reform. He found himself in be settled till this measure was adopted; a false position, and had receded from the and they did not despair, for, knowing the point which he appeared at first to have general feeling of the people, they knew taken up with the same desperate resolu- that the measure could not long be retion with which he had taken up his po- sisted. And who were those who resisted sition at Waterloo-a position from which it? One set of its opponents was a parcel he said he would not move, and which of intriguing gentlemen at the west end of the valour of our brave countrymen, on the town; and there were intriguing ladies, whose rights they were now deciding, had too, mighty gossips in this our commonenabled him to maintain. On that occa- wealth," whose interference in such matsion his resolution was nobly justified by ters was a thing, he must say, hitherto the courage of the men whom he then com- unknown. He regretted that interference, manded; but on the present he was forced because he thought that when ladies once to abandon his ground. It was true he had got out of the domestic circle, and got into not now the same steady troops as on that the political, they lost much of the inoccasion; his present followers fell off from fluence they would otherwise properly the advanced posts to which he had ordered possess; and he was tempted to pass upon them, but which they found to be positions them a similar judgment to that which that were quite untenable, and he himself Mrs. Peachum, in The Beggar's Opera, was at last obliged to give up his position passed upon them. Mrs. Peachum said, and effect his retreat. But what was the "Women are bitter bad judges in cases of cause of all this? It was the strong ne- murder ;" and so, he said, "Women are cessity which neither he nor any other man bitter bad judges in cases of politics." could resist. It was clear that there was For himself he could only say, that, conno hope for the amelioration of grievances sidering things as they now stood, he of which the people had often complained, could almost wish the Kings in past times -but the complaints about which had had made use of their prerogative, and hitherto been disregarded-but the adop- had discontinued to send Writs to decayed tion of this measure of Reform-and its boroughs, and had, at the same time, sent


Writs to boroughs that had grown great and flourishing. If that prerogative had been used, that House would not have been in the situation in which it was now, but there would have been, as it were, a daily Reform, suppressing the elective franchise of inconsiderable boroughs, and transferring it to new and populous and flourishing towns. The King, no doubt, possessed the right of withholding these Writs, and of issuing them; and had that course been adopted from the beginning, there would have been a Reform of Parliament which would not have required the interference of the House of Peers. Indeed, he was almost prepared to say, that as Reform essentially concerned the privileges of that House, and the control over the public purse (a control of which, on other occasions, they were so jealous So said the people of England at this that they would not permit the other House moment. They would recede much if to make the smallest alteration in their they were satisfied that they should get money bills-not even in a relaxation of the what they wanted, and what they had a public burthens), it was a matter with which right to ask, namely, a practical control the other House ought not to interfere. over the public expenditure; but if that He was sorry that the House of Lords should were refused them-if friendliness was thus have brought themselves into a situa- dropped, and the matter became one of tion far from estimable, in the eyes of the bargain, they would "cavil about the country, doing themselves no good, and ninth part of a hair." In his opinion, his forcing upon the minds of the people an Majesty's Ministers deserved the confiinquiry as to the limits of their privileges.dence of the country; and he was anxious He wished to see the Constitution pre-to impress that on the country, for they served; he believed it was an excellent had given an earnest of their honest Constitution in practice; but when it had intentions, and confidence in them would been corrupted, it should be purified; and, enable them to follow out what they had therefore, he wished to see a fair and free thus begun, while a different course would and full representation of the people, for but impede them in carrying into executhat was part of the Constitution; and he, tion the plan of Reform they had laid therefore, did regret most deeply, that the before the country. He knew it might be Peers should have opposed themselves to said that the people were properly jealous a demand which was made by the whole of bestowing their unlimited confidence ; people of England-namely, that a mea- but if it was unwise to give the Governsure should be passed to secure to them meat their confidence lest they might be their constitutional right-the right of betrayed, was it not equally unwise to controlling the public purse. What did withhold their confidence when they had all the rant about Jacobinism and revolu- good grounds for yielding it? In the tion mean-what did it come to but this conduct of all matters confidence was --that those who ranted thus wished still necessary. In this instance it had been to exclude the people from the right he given, and it should not now be withdrawn. had referred to the right which they now What greater claim to confidence could sought with so much anxiety? In what be put forward by any Ministry than was was passing out of doors he saw nothing put forward by the present in this one to alarm men, except they went on ex-measure? What they proposed was a asperating the public by delay and refusal, voluntary act of theirs-they had embarked till the public would no longer be satisfied themselves in the same boat, in the same with this just, rational, and effective mea-vessel, with the liberties of their country, sure, but would be determined to have and they had identified their interests with more than their warmest friends now called those of the people. They were in the on the opposite party to grant. They same situation as the Roman army which

must all recollect the play of Henry IV.,
when Hotspur, Owen Glendower, and
others, were engaged in portioning out
England. In that scene, Glendower had
taken the Trent for the limit of his
portion; and Hotspur, thinking it would
trench too much upon his portion, said—
"I'll have the current in this place damm'd up;
It shall not wind with such a deep indent,
To rob me of so rich a bottom here."
Glendower, of course, objected, and words
ran high between them; Hotspur was told
he should not anger Owen Glendower, for
Glendower was a friend; on which Hot-
spur, with true English feeling exclaimed-

I'll give thrice so much land


To any well-deserving friend,
But in the way of bargain, mark ye me,
I'll cavil on the ninth part of a hair."

went out to conquer their neighbours, the Samnites. The Roman Consul, who had determined not to retreat, placed his army in such a position, that it was impossible for the army to escape from a victorious enemy, and they had, therefore, no alternative but to conquer. The Roman Consul, in his speech to his soldiers, told them, that the contest would be desperate -that they would have to combat an enemy equally numerous, equally well disciplined, equally provided with arms, and equally full of courage with themselves; but he added, that they had one advantage-quod maxima et ultima erant necessitate superiori. That was the situation of the Ministers-by necessity alone they would be compelled to be victorious; they were to fall or stand by this measure; and they were sure of victory, for they were sure of the public support, and with that support they could not fail. He trusted that they would not be pressed in any way to promise a particular line of conduct. He trusted that his Majesty and his Majesty's Ministers would be enabled to relieve the country from those difficulties in which for a century past it had been involved, and that they would succeed in procuring for the country that representation, without which it was in vain to hope for good government without which a good Government could not go on, and which alone would be able

Lord Althorp did not think that the wording of petitions from the people in times of great excitement ought to be too strictly looked at. If the hon. Baronet opposite meant to ask him, did he approve of the language of the petition? He was perfectly ready to say he did not. It was language such as he hoped he never approached to himself, and such as he was sure could be of no sort of use in the discussion of political questions. But if the hon. Baronet asked him, did he think that the petition ought to be received in the ordinary manner in which petitions upon important subjects were received, and should be permitted to be printed? That,

to secure the public tranquillity and hap-he would answer, was altogether a ques piness. tion of expediency. The expressions to which the hon. Baronet objected related to the particular conduct of noble individuals in the other House of Parliament; and he had known the House to receive and to print petitions animadverting, in very strong terms, not only on individuals in either House of Parliament, but upon the conduct of the whole Legislature. He, therefore, did not think that the House would do wisely in negativing the Motion of his hon. friend. But in giving that opinion, he hoped he should not be supposed to agree in or to sanction the language of the petitioners.

Mr. Kennedy said, he must enter his protest against the doctrine of appealing to Ministers, as members of the Government on questions like the present. They ought to give their opinions only as individual Members of the House in matters which were not connected with the policy of their Government. As to the question before them, he must say, that if hon.

Mr. Goulburn was surprised at the course which the hon. Baronet had taken on this occasion. He would not, however, follow him in his very excursive speech. It was a speech which would almost make the House believe it had been intended for another occasion, but that, by some accident or other, the hon. Baronet had missed the opportunity of delivering it, and was therefore anxious, as he seemed to think it so good an oration, that the House should not separate without having had the benefit of hearing it. He would not presume to inquire whether the hon. Baronet was smarting under the witicisms of that sex he had so ungallantly alluded to, but he would confine himself simply to the question before the House, and he would contend that there would be an end to the freedom of debate, if the conduct of Members in either House were to be attacked as that of the majority of the House of Lords had been in the petition

before them. Would the House, he asked, give its sanction, by causing it to be printed, to such language as this-"that the interests of the country were sacrificed or endangered by the selfish obstinacy of 200 individuals?" And that no doubt might apply to whom it alluded, this paragraph followed, "by the folly and obstinacy of a numerical majority in the House of Lords." Was this language which the House would sanction as applying to the majority of the other House of Parliament ? He would put it to the noble Lord at the head of the Government in that House, whether he would consent to the printing of a petition containing such an attack on the other House of Parliament?

Gentlemen opposite knew the state of feeling in the country, they would rather feel pleasure than regret that it vented itself in this harmless way. If petitions of this kind were rejected on account of strong language, depend on it the people would press round the throne and give expression to opinions much stronger. In fact, the petitions which had been presented by the people, proved the complete tranquillity of the country; and that it was, he believed, at which hon. Gentlemen opposite were so much disappointed. The country was, however, he was happy to say, perfectly tranquil. He could speak more particularly of that part of the kingdom with which he was more immediately connected (Scotland); but he would not say that that tranquillity would be permanent, if the measure of Reform were unnecessarily delayed-ultimately refused it could not be but he could not look without serious apprehension at the consequences of any unnecessary delay.

Mr. George Bankes said, he must repel with indignation the imputation of the hon. Member who last addressed the House, that Members at that (the Opposition) side were disappointed at the tranquil state of the country. They had never expected that the country would be otherwise than tranquil, and therefore the tranquillity which now prevailed was not matter of surprise, still less of disappointment, to them. They objected to such language as this petition contained, because they expected that bodies who wished to be considered deliberative assemblies would use more caution than men who met only for one occasion. The hon. Baronet had adverted to the Orange and Brunswick clubs, which he assumed were founded on the principles of the Members on the Opposition side of the House; but what would the hon. Baronet say, if petitions were presented from any of those clubs, complaining of the selfish obstinacy of Lord Grey and his colleagues, in sacrificing or endangering the interests of the country, by persisting in a violent change of the Constitution? Would the hon. Baronet think that the House ought to sanction language of that kind by ordering the petition to be printed? He had no desire to reject the petitions of any portion of the people, but he did desire that the petitions should be worded in respectful language. The question now before the House was, not whether the

petition should be rejected, for no one had any such wish, but whether the House would so far sanction the language which the noble Lord (Althorp) had declared he disapproved, as to direct it to be printed. There were many parts of the hon. Baronet's speech which he regretted, but he concurred with him in that where he put forth the prerogatives of the Crown so prominently. He was glad, also, to hear him speak of the Sovereign as the father of his people; but it did sometimes happen, that the fondest fathers mistook the passions of their children, and indulged those passions to the prejudice of their real interests.

Mr. James Johnstone congratulated the House on the state of tranquillity which prevailed in that part of the empire (Scotland) to which he belonged. He did not think that the hon. Baronet opposite did right in sneering at the Political Unions. He begged to remind the hon. Baronet that peace had been preserved in those places where Political Unions were established, and that riots and conflagrations had taken place in those parts of the country where there existed no Political UnionsNottingham and Derby, for instance. 150 years ago, the people were little better than serfs, and were treated nearly the same as slaves were now treated in the West Indies, but the spread of intelligence had given them a moral strength which entitled them to a large increase of influence in the Constitution. He thought that the sooner the House met after the prorogation the better; and he believed that if the present Ministers were to leave office the whole country would be on fire.

Mr. Hunt said, the hon. Member who had just sat down, had made use of stronger expressions than was contained in any petition, but he merely wished to remark, in reply to the hon. Baronet (Sir Francis Burdett) opposite, who had said no person out of Bedlam could expect the people to be wholly unanimous in favour of Reform, that he (Mr. Hunt) believed they were nearly unanimous, but it was for a more extensive measure of Reform than the late Bill. The hon. Baronet had also been pleased to insinuate, that those who would not receive the franchise under the Bill, would still receive some benefit from its being extended; why this sounded very like virtual representation. He must declare that the Ministers were not entitled to his confidence, although he hoped he

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