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• pressing considerable alarm on the subject the Judges and Registrars might be very of the Cholera Morbus.

beneficially employed as puffers. Sir Richard Vyuyan suggested to the Mr. Hume wished to know whether the right hon. Gentleman opposite whether, noble Lord opposite intended to introduce as all persons coming from Hamburgh must a clause into the bill to render the case of perform quarantine, it would not be ad- each of the existing Commissioners, with viseable to put an entire stop to the steam respect to compensation, subject to innavigation.

quiry. He also stated his objections to Mr. Poulett Thomson thought that that giving the Judges appointed under the object could be effected of itself, without bill any superannuation allowance. any official regulations on the subject. Lord Althorp said, that the case of

Sir Richard Vyvyan observed, that a each individual Commissioner, with revessel after remaining twenty-one days in spect to compensation, would be taken quarantine, had worked its way up to under the consideration of the Treasury, London and discharged a cargo of rags. and decided on according to its own He thought that if there had been any in- merits. That was the principle upon fection in the rags, it could not have been which compensation was now given. With got rid of in the course of twenty-one days. respect to the retiring allowances to the

Mr. Poulett Thomson said, that the im- Judges, he had already stated his own portation of rags coming from infected opinion--and he was inclined to maintain places, was now prohibited.

that opinion—that persons appointed to Mr. Hunt advised the Government to judicial situations ought to be allowed retake the duty off soap. The poor classes tiring pensions ; or else they might keep would then be able to keep themselves their offices when they were too old proclean; and cleanliness would be found the perly to discharge the duties. But he had best preventive of Cholera Morbus. since communicated with the Lord Chan

cellor on the subject ; and that noble and BANKRUPTCY COURT Bill.] Lord learned Lord considered, that the principle Althorp moved the third reading of this upon which the hon member for MiddleBill.

sex had urged his objection to their reMr. Warburton begged to ask the hon. tiring pensions, was unanswerable. The and learned Gentleman whether the three noble and learned Lord said, that it was Commissioners of the Sub-division Court the duty of every person to lay by part of must be unanimous ? hitherto, the practice bis income for support in his old age, the had been, that a majority of opinions was more particularly when bis income was regarded as decisive.

not variable, but fixed. No clause with The Attorney-General said, the practice respect to compensation had been introwould be continued, and the opinions of a duced into the Bill, because the general majority of the Comn:issioners be con-act, relating to compensation, did not sidered decisive.

apply to judicial offices. Mr. Warburton said, he wished to make Mr. Wrangham said, he regretted that one or two further remarks. He under- so many personal remarks were mixed up stood a certain amount was to be paid with this question. Those who felt it when a dividend was declared; he, there their duty to oppose the Bill, were defore, begged to suggest, whether a certain scribed as factious. Such language was as rate per cent would not be more ad- painful to those to whom it was addressed, viseable? again, he wished to know, whether as it was unbecoming to those who used it the official Assignees would be allowed to -- he admitted the evils of the existing act as auctioneers ?

system, and was willing to remedy them; but The Attorney-General said, with regard he did not think that the Bill would effect to the first point mentioned by the hon. any improvement. The principle defects Gentleman, à clause was prepared which of the present system were, the great numhe hoped would meet his views; and with her of tribunals, the number of Judges respect to the second, there was nothing in in them, and that they were not constantly the Bill to prevent the official Assignees open. These evils could be reached only from acting as auctioneers.

by diminishing the number of Judges, and Sir Charles Wetherell said, that arrange- making them sit continually ment would be an excellent one. It would adjournment. The Bill, in fact proceeded make the new Court an auction mart, and partly upon that principle, but it did not diminish the number of tribunals, for it es- I believed, as the Bill now stood, it would be tablished a Court of Review, which he found impracticable in several points. At held to be unnecessary. He thought present he would only allude to one, and that the Judges of the Division Courts that was, that the Bank of England neimight have occasional meetings in larger ther could nor would undertake some of numbers, and perform the duties assigned the duties and charges which the Bill conto the Court of Review. Again, he looked templated. He recommended this point with some fear at the new Bankruptcy at least to the serious attention of the Court being independent of the Court noble Lord. of Chancery, on account of the intricacy Sir Charles Wetherell said, that since and importance of some of the questions he had practised in Westminster-hall, he which were occasionally to be decided; and never remembered any Bill for the amendhe thought there was some danger in ment of the law so pregnant with mischief leaving the power of deciding these to a and danger as the present measure. The tribunal of inferior importance. Of course Tory party had been accused of being that could not be attended by the first hostile to all Reform, and had been deadvocates, and the suitors must experi- scribed as “ factious.” “ To that he would ence disadvantages on that account. Even simply say, they had made many reforms in allowing a Court of Review to be neces- the jurisprudence of the country, and sary, he had heard no reason for appoint that they had proceeded upon sound prining four Judges to preside in it. One he ciples, and after due inquiry. He could thought would be sufficient, and this had by no means give the same credit to the been so evident to the framers of the Bill, author of this measure. He hoped it would that they had provided other duties for be the last attempt at the emendation of these Judges, besides performing the duties the law which would ever proceed from of the Court of Review. It was arranged, the same quarter from which this had therefore, that they should act separately as originated." He took leave of the Bill Commissioners, and preside over the trial of with the prediction that the Bankruptcy issues. With regard to these parts of their Courts would not endure long. duties if they were to preside only as Com- Bill read a third time and passed. missioners, they ought to be paid as such, and notas Judges; and as to their presiding over trials, the three main sources of

out any

HOUSE OF LORDS, issues would by the very provisions of the Wednesday, October 19, 1831. Bill itself, be cut off.

MINUTES.] Bills. Read a third time and passsed; Crown Mr. Freshfield said, upon this last oc

Lands; Inclosure; (Standing Orders suspended). casion he must protest against that art Petitions presented. By two NOBLE Lords, from the Ca

tholic Inhabitants of Moycullen for the Extension of the of the measure which appointed official

Galway Franchise to Catholics, and from the Inhabitants of assignees. The consequence of it would Silverston, in favour of the Reform Bill. be that no respectable creditor would act as assignee with them, and that frauds COAL TRADE.] Lord Wharncliffe said, which were now discovered would remain that he had learnt that a conversation had undetected, as the official assignee could taken place in their Lordships' House a have no interest in bringing them to light. few days ago, upon the third reading of the Another consequence of their appointment Appropriation Bill, in which a noble friend would be, that Commissions of Bank- of his had taken occasion to say something ruptcy from Bristol, Manchester, and other with respect to the operation of the recent places, would cease to be worked in Lon-removal of the Coal duties. His noble don to avoid the additional expense that friend had complained that the result of would accrue to the estate from their per the measure of removing the duties was, to centage being paid out of it in addition to occasion a very considerable loss to the other charges. The little the Judges of revenue, without any corresponding benefit the Court of Review would have to do to the

He stated that the would be still further reduced by the di- price of coals to the consumer was minution of bankrupt cases worked in only 2s. less, and that the difference London, and the Chancellor and Vice between that and the 6s. of duty removed Chancellor be but little relieved; for they must go into some other pockets. He would still have to attend to all questions (Lord Wharncliffe) was anxious that the connected with country bankruptcies. He coal-owners should stand clear with the public, and he could assure the House, the noble Duke to have said, that the that if the public did not benefit to the public had not derived the full advantage full extent of the duties removed, the coal- of taking off the duties, but he had not owners were by no means benefitted by understood the noble Duke to say by the difference, which had not gone into whom the benefit had been reaped, altheir pockets. The prices of coals at though the presumption was, that it was Newcastle and Sunderland were precisely the coal-owners. the same now as they were before the


Motion agreed to. duties were removed; and in point of fact, the coal-owners were losers instead of BANKRUPTCY COURT BILL.) 'The gainers. When the tax was taken off, Lord Chancellor, in moving their Lordthe stock in London was extremely low, in ships to agree to the Amendments which consequence of the anticipation generally the Bankruptcy Court Bill had received entertained that the tax would be re- in the other House, felt it his duty to duced. The coal-owners continued to state to their Lordships what those supply the market as isual for a few Amendments were. The first was, the weeks, when the workmen at the pits see- disqualifying of the Judges of the Court ing a favourable opportunity, struck for from sitting in Parliament, and this he an increase of wages, and they kept the should say was merely supplying what pits for seven weeks unworked; so that had been an inadvertence in their Lordcoals were actually imported into New- ships' House. There were one or two castle in order to keep the different steam- alterations in the Bill which were of little engines at work. This had ended in an consequence, but he should open to their increase of wages to the amount of from Lordships what were the main alterations ten to fourteen per cent, and as the price which had been made in the Bill. The of coals had not increased, the coal-owners machinery for compensating persons who were consequently losers to this extent. In were to lose by the Bill, was perfectly addition to this, the workmen by an agree- satisfactory to those who, like Lord ment among themselves, would not work Thurlow, were concerned in it, and their beyond earning a certain sum a day. Lordships could have no objection to this This state of things was brought on un- clause as it now stood. He would merely doubtedly from one of those combinations observe, that no compensation was in any among the operatives, which caused in case to be given in the lump, but only accreased difficulties every day, in carrying on cording to the claims of each individual. any kind of trade in this country. The result The only material alteration which the Bill of this combination among the colliers was, had undergone, he would now explain to that the coal-owners could not supply the the House. He had stated in the first markets to the extent of making up their instance, that the Judges of the Court losses sustained by the increase of wages. were to have retiring pensions after twenty He would only add, that if the workmen years' service. They were now to have no were allowed to proceed as they at present pensions, and it was in his opinion that it occasionally did, it would strike at the was not necessary to give learned persons prosperity of the manufactures and com- in such places retiring pensions. If a man merce of the country. The coal-owners, it at the Bar received his employment by the was to be feared, would not be able to year, he had a precarious income, and was supply the markets adequately with coals subject to various accidents. He might until next spring, if they had to con- lose his health, become old, or might lose tend with such combinations ; but their his business, without any fault of his and he inclinations and their interest both in- must be exposed to every accident, physiduced them to furnish an ample supply, cal and moral, and to all the changes which as the reduction of price ought to cause those who followed the profession of the an increased consumption which the coal- law so well knew themselves to be liable owners were anxious to meet. He should to. For these reasons every man of prumove, “that there be laid before the dence inade provision for his family, and House a return of the prices in the Lon- { when he came upon the Bench he was don markets of seaborne coals, from the generally possessed of a considerable for1st of February to the 17th of October, tune. He would ask, why should not the 1831."

Judges make provision for their families, The Earl of Falmouth had understood either by laying up money, or by means of that most excellent invention of life-assur- of local jurisdictions--the plan of making ance ?

Why should not a man with a justice more cheap and more accessible to fixed income insure his life as well as a man all men. He would answer, that he inwho possessed a precarious income? In tended to adopt the salutary suggestions the case of a Judge, he could not see that of the present Chief Baron, and to submit there was any necessity for a retiring pen to the Commissioners of Legal Inquiry the sion. If it should be found that the effect whole question of those local courts for the of this doctrine would be to prevent the purpose of its undergoing the most thorough getting of the assistance of men of sufficient investigation. In six months or less, a ability and experience from the Bar, or if very important Report would be made it should make men adhere pertinaciously from the Commissioners upon the subject to the gains of office after they were unfit of the local court jurisdiction. for the adequate performance of theirduties, The Earlof Hardwicke begged to ask his then it would be fit that their Lordships noble and learned Lord, whether it was his should again send the Bill to the other intention to make any improvement in the House of Parliament; or rather, as this laws respecting creditors who avoided the was a money clause, it would be fit that payment of their just debts by leaving the the other House should of itself revise this country, and residing abroad. He now clause. He had to move that the Amend knew a person who resided at Boulogne ments be agreed to.-Ordered accord for this purpose, though he regularly reingly.

ceived an income of 8001. a quarter, from

his property in this kingdom. EXCHEQUER COURT--(SCOTLAND.)] The Lord Chancellor said, that the subject The Duke of Buccleuch wished to know which the noble Earl had mentioned was if the noble and learned Lord would lay one of the very highest importance, and it upon the Table of the House the returns had received a due consideration from the for which he had moved, relative to the Commissioners of Law Inquiry. It would Exchequer Court of Scotland, they were, be a very imperfect arrangement which did An account of the number of cases in not provide for cases such as the noble the Court of Exchequer in Scotland, dis- Earl had mentioned. He (the Lord Chantinguishing undefended causes, causes cellor) abstained from stating the principles tried, defended causes tried, and causes upon which the Commissioners had procompromised without any trial, for the last ceeded; but he would say, that a more five years, distinguishing each year. shameful, scandalous state of the law

The Lord Chancellor had no objection could not possibly exist, than that of whatever to lay the papers upon the Table which persons could avail themselves by of the House. He should take the oppor- going abroad, or living within the rules of tunity of his being upon his legs to advert the King's Bench, and thereby avoid the to an observation which had been made payment of their debts. He himself relative to the amendment of the Bank- knew a man of 8,0001. a-year who lived rupt-laws themselves. A Commission had in the rules in order to avoid his creditors. been sitting during the whole of the last The expenses of law proceedings, those of twelve months, and learned Commissioners the Insolvent Court, the discharge of prihad been added to it, in lieu of those who soners, the expenses of debtors while had been promoted to the Bench. The in gaol, and those of collecting debts, Commissioners had entered into the most amounted altogether to 600,0001. a-year, important questions of law — such as and all this was abstracted from the funds of the law of debtor and creditor and the the creditors. In addition to this the sum great subject of imprisonment for debt. of 116,0001. a-year was spent in justifying They had collected a vast mass of the bail. If the Report of the Commission of most important information from persons Law Inquiry was attended to, this sum of experienced both in law and in trade, and between 700,0001. and 800,0001. a-year they had examined between 300 and 400 would be thus swept away from such a persons, so that they would be able to useless direction, and added to the fund make a Report which would be the founda- for the payment of creditors. tion of some of the most salutary alterations Viscount Melville wished to take that which ever were made upon such great and opportunity of making an observation or two important subjects. He had been asked on the Court of Exchequer in Scotland. whether he intended to abandon the plan | The reason why so small a number of cases were decided in that Court was, the system right to tithes in kind could be claimed. adopted of trying such causes in inferior ?'he petitioners stated, that for the last Courts where it was usual to compound 250 years the lands in their parishes for penalties : when prosecutions were had been exempt from tithes, except upon instituted, the defenders were induced to wheat, for which they paid a modus. Reenter into compositions, and to pay a com-cently, however, the right to levy tithes in position for the penalties, in order to save kind upon the whole land had been claimed, expenses. That was the cause of so and legal proceedings taken to enforce it. litile business being done in the Court of He very much regretted that the bill which Exchequer. That power of compounding had been proposed on the subject of Prewas one which ought not to be intrusted scription, and which would have put an to an inferior Court, but ought to be under end to so monstrous an evil, had not been the control of the higliest law officers of passed. the Crown. That was a system which had Mr. Warburton thought that any future grown up of late years.

measure introduced on this subject hereThe Lord Chancellor said, the same after should be retrospective in its operasystem of compromise in revenue causes tion, because in the interval many claims prevailed very much in the Court of Ex- would be made, and these would be the chequer here also. The Crown neither cause of much expensive and vexatious gave nor received costs; and it was often litigation. thought adviseable to compromise. The Mr. John Campbell regretted the loss revenue causes occupied but a very small of the former bill the less, as he considered portion comparatively of the English it very objectionable in several of its proCourt of Exchequer, the Judges of which visions. One clause in particular, which tried other causes, and went the circuits. had been introduced by a right reverend The Scotch Court, on the contrary, was Prelate in the other House of Parliament, entirely confined to revenue causes.

The was

so exceedingly obnoxious that he returns called for by the noble Duke (the could by no means have consented to it. Duke of Buccleuch) extended only to the The Petition was ordered to be printed. number of causes tried in the Scotch Court of Exchequer in each year during

REFORM.-Petitions.] Mr. Hume prethe last five years. If the noble Duke sented a Petition from the Council of the pleased, this might be extended to twenty Birmingham Political Union respecting years.

the late rejection of the Reform Bill. He The Duke of Buccleuch said, he should said that this petition had been sent to be happy to attend to the suggestions of his hon, and learned friend the member the noble and learned Lord.

for Kerry, and he presented it on behalf of A return was accordingly ordered of the that hon, and learned Gentleman. He number of causes tried in the Scotch Court took that opportunity of expressing his of Exchequer in each year during the last opinion in favour of Political Unions. twenty years, distinguishing between those Much had been said upon the impropriety compromised and those not compromised. of suffering large bodies of men to assem

ble together for the avowed purpose of HOUSE OF COMMONS,

effecting a common object; but he was

firmly persuaded that bodies of persons so Wednesday, October 19, 1831.

united were highly useful, because they Minutes.) Bills. Vestries : Lords Amendment agreed to. induced the people to seek by order, rea

On the Motion of Mr. June, the number son, and steadiness of purpose, that which of Persons Imprisoned for Offences against the Game

might otherwise be sought by riot, violence, Petitions presented. By Mr. Evans, from the Journeymen and bloodshed. If there had been a

Shoemakers of Northampton, for the Repeal of the Tax on Political Union in Derby, or in NottingNewspapers:-By Mr. Hume, from Householders of Clerkenwell, for a Repeal of the House and Window Tax ; from ham, the riots which had disgraced those an Individual confined in the King's Bench Prison, places never would have taken place. In against the Law of Arrest for Debt; from the Inhabitants that respect, the conduct of the Political of Chichester for the abolition of the Pension List

Union at Birmingham deserved the approTirhes-- PRESCRIPTION.] Mr. Hume bation of that House. In that town, though presented a Petition from the land-owners the feeling was as strong as in any other of Nether Staveley and Over Staveley, part of the empire, not the slightest for a limitation of time beyond which no tumult had occurred. The petitioners

Returns ordered.


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