currence in the concluding sentiments of the hon. and learned Gentleman. The House, and the public in general, he was sure, would hear with great satisfaction, the renewed assurance of the Ministers, that they would use all the power with which they were intrusted by the Constitution to repress outrage and violence, and preserve the peace and tranquillity of the country. He begged further to be permitted to remark, that although he could not support his Majesty's present Government, still they should not find him contributing to create exasperation, or taking any other course than that which would support them under the difficulties and perils which at present beset the country, in every way that he could, consistently with his own principles. He was not sorry that this debate had arisen, because it had called forth a public announcement of a determination which some had doubted, but of which he entertained no doubt-a determination on the part of his Majesty's Government to do impartial justice, and preserve the peace of the country. Mr. James E. Gordon said, that he felt convinced that every person possessed of property or having the interest of his country at heart, must lament the alarming occurrences which had recently prevailed in various places. Under the circumstances of excitement, that existed, however, he thought the disturbances might be considered extremely partial and of small amount, when the means were considered by which the minds of the community had been so greatly exasperated. He rejoiced to hear the assurance that his Majesty's Government would enforce the powers of the law to protect the public. At the same time he must express his disapproval of many of the remarks which had been made by various Members, and he must also take the opportunity of saying, that he had never heard a more revolting attack than that which had been made by the hon. and learned Member behind him (Mr. O'Connell), upon the hon. and learned Gentleman near him (Sir Charles Wetherell). Mr. Hume protested against the language used by the hon. Member. His hon. friend had only answered an attack which had been made upon him by the hon. and learned member for Boroughbridge, and therefore it was very unfair to charge him with having made a revolting attack. He considered the spirited and proper manner with which his hon. and learned friend repelled the attack, and retorted upon the aggressor, did him great credit, and he must further be permitted to say, that if any hon. Member in that House used strong and unmeasured language, he must expect to be replied to in the same manner. Mr. Henry Grattan said, that although he was not connected with the Government, and, so far as Ireland was concerned, did not approve of its measures, yet he could not sit and listen to such unfounded, illiberal, unwarranted, ungenerous, and unjust attacks, as were made upon Ministers by the hon. and learned Gentleman, who had gone so far as to assert that there was a treasonable conspiracy not to pay taxes, which his Majesty's Government encouraged. He was convinced that the hon. and learned Gentleman did not believe what he said himself [order, order]. He was not disorderly, and would not sit down. He repeated that he did not believe what the hon. and learned Member had said was his sincere opinion, because, if he had been serious in it, he ought to have impeached Ministers who had the folly and the audacity to abandon their duty to their King and to their country, and that duty which was imposed on every well-regulated man, whether he was a Minister or not. But the hon. and learned Gentleman had not confined his attacks to his Majesty's Government. The hon. and learned Gentleman had taken occasion to say that Irishmen were not cowards. He would tell the hon. and learned Gentleman what was his idea of spirit. He thought, that to apply offensive terms in quarters where they could not receive the answer they ought, was not the part of a man of spirit. If the hon. and learned Gentleman chose to use such language, let him apply it in some other quarter, and see The Speaker rose, and said, that the language which had been used was as improper as any one Member could apply to another. He put it-not to the Housebut to the hon. Member himself, on reflection, whether he had ever heard the hon. and learned Member to whom he alluded use such language without being called to order for it? Mr. Henry Grattan said, he was wholly misunderstood; he had put the case hypothetically. The Speaker said, the hon. Member must be aware that putting a hypothetical in the terms which he employed. The case was not the way to evade what would be in itself disorderly. Mr. H. Grattan said, he meant nothing disorderly or disrespectful to the House; but when the hon. and learned Gentleman talked a great deal of Irishmen, and then turned his back to the Chair, and looked at the Irish Members, he felt justified in assuring the hon. and learned Gentleman, that there was nothing that he could insinuate against the Irish Members, either for their support of the Government, or on any other ground, which they would not repel in a proper manner. The charges which he had brought against his Majesty's Ministers were wholly, absolutely, and completely unfounded. hon. and learned Gentleman who was alluded to, had first attacked a noble friend of his, and then he attacked the hon. and learned Gentleman near him, and he conceived the latter hon. and learned Gentleman was justified in replying to him. peared from the speech of the hon. and learned Gentleman (the Attorney-General) that he had been misinformed, for none of the ringleaders were as yet taken. When he understood, and heard it asserted, that the respectable inhabitant householders had been sworn in, and were very active in the performance of the duties of Special Constables, he must express his astonishment that the incendiaries were not taken up; but the Yeomanry Cavalry had taken up some persons who had nothing to do with the offence. He did not mean to say that his Majesty's Government encouraged these acts of outrage when they were committed; but he thought there had been a sort of encouragement going on for a long Mr. Hunt said, he could not concur in the present Motion until the real state of the case was completely known. It appeared, however, that there had been riots at Nottingham, and that the populace, after having destroyed a nobleman's mansion, had returned to the attack the next day, as it seemed, to consummate their own infamy. The hon. and learned Gentleman had further assumed that some of the persons who had been guilty of these Lord Brudenell said, that in his opin-gross outrages were in custody, but it apion, his hon. and learned friend (Sir C. Wetherell) had been most unfairly dealt with, and had been attacked in the most unmerited manner. Nothing that his hon. and learned friend had said would bear the construction endeavoured to be fastened upon it. His hon. and learned | friend said, that his Majesty's Government were not using the means which would tend to preserve the peace of the country. The course which they were taking was playing too much into the hands of the populace, and would lead to violence and breach of the law, instead of suppressing disturbances. As a proof of this he would put it to any hon. Member who heard him, if he thought efficient measures had been yesterday resorted to to preserve the tran-time, and the Government had suffered quillity of the metropolis. As to the charge which had been made against his hon. and learned friend, of using offensive language, because he knew it could receive no reply, he did not believe there was an hon. Member in the House capable of such conduct. If another hon. and learned Member was-he would not say exempt-but if he exempted himself from all responsibility, he certainly ought to be cautious and more guarded in his own expressions. Sir John Hobhouse begged to suggest to the noble Lord, that the continuance of these discussions would do no good, and that it would be better to avoid saying the harshest thing that could be said of a man in his absence. Lord Brudenell said, he would appeal to the House whether it was not incumbent upon any man who exempted himself from responsibility, to be cautious himself the newspapers, which were their organs, to excite the multitude to violence. It was not, therefore, enough for him now to hear his Majesty's Ministers say they were sorry for the outrages which had been committed, and that they would do all they could to put an end to them. They ought to have taken means to put an end to the excitement which had been created. The Attorney-General said, in explanation, that the force employed at Nottingham did not reach the spot in time to prevent the conflagration, or arrest the authors of it, but their exertions were the means of preventing further outrages. Sir Charles Wetherell felt called upon to reply to some remarks that had been made in the course of the debate. Sir John Newport rose to order. He begged to submit to the Chair, whether an hon. Gentleman was entitled to reply on merely proposing an amendment. Sir Charles Wetherell: "I won't say a word upon sufferance." The Amendment was then put and negatived. On the Original Question being put, Lord Althorp said, as he understood it was allowed that the part of the advertisement complained of, arose, in part, out of clerical error, he should beg leave to move the Previous Question. The Speaker said, that the hon. and | and the most suitable remedy. Certain learned Gentleman had certainly no right inconveniences, which were inseparable to speak if the House objected to it. But from all Courts, had been treated as if it was for the House to say how far it they were peculiarly incidental to the prewould hear the hon. and learned Gentle- sent system of bankruptcy. Appeals were man, after the discussion which had taken great inconveniences, but they did not explace. The hon. and learned Gentleman clusively belong to bankruptcy. Unless must be aware that he depended upon the the fiat of an arbitrary Court was subsufferance of the House. mitted to, the expense of the delay of appeals must be incurred; and in proportion as appeals were multiplied, the sources of expense and delay were also multiplied. But this must be the case, until mutability was removed from human affairs. He objected to the Court of Review as unnecessary, for he considered the duties which were attached to it ought to devolve on the Vice-Chancellor, with an appeal to the Lord Chancellor. The Judges of the Court of Review appeared to him to be a useless incumbrance-an impediment over which it was necessary to pass in order to get at the Lord Chancellor. With respect to the charge of the present Commissioners BANKRUPTCY COURT BILL-COM- being, for the most part, young men just MITTEE THIRD DAY.] On the Mo-called to the Bar, he had only to say,that an tion of the Attorney-General, the Order of the Day for resuming the Debate on the Amendment for referring the Bankruptcy Court Bill to a Select Committee was read. Mr. Herries observed, that after the discussion that had taken place, he should recommend his hon. friend to withdraw his Motion. Motion withdrawn. Mr. George Bankes wished to ask the Attorney-General, whether this Bill was to be followed by another, and whether that Supplementary Bill was to contain a provision, giving the Lord Chancellor an additional retiring pension of 2,000l. The Attorney-General said, he was not aware whether there was to be a Supplementary Bill or not; but it would not include the provision referred to. understanding had existed that gentlemen should have been seven years in the profession before they were appointed Commissioners; and, if a Lord Chancellor were to appoint such persons as had not been seven years, he would neglect his duty. To fill up the appointments in the new Court, a selection might be made from the present Commissioners, and this might be done both advantageously as regarded the character of the Court, and also would be attended with a great saving to the public. The noble and learned Lord at the head of the Court had now got rid of the arrears of the Court, and he had stated his intention, so far as he had understood the noble Lord's oration, to take original motions, along with the Master of the Rolls, without the assistance of the ViceChancellor, so that the Vice-Chancellor, who had kept down the bankrupt cases hitherto, could take these cases in future, and it was, therefore, not possible to conceive what public benefit could arise from these four Judges; they were not an additional facility, but an additional impediment. He considered the whole scheme as only intended to get rid of the ViceChancellor, which he thought most impo Mr. Pemberton wished that a greater latitude of time should be allowed for the discussion of this most important question, than it appeared the noble and learned Lord, who was the author of the measure, appeared inclined to allow them. He wished to speak of that noble and learned Lord with the respect he felt for him and for his extraordinary talents; but he would not permit himself to be restrained by any influence to be exercised elsewhere, in his Court, or out of it, from expressing himself with freedom, yet with a proper tone and temper. With respect to this Bill, those who pointed at the de-litic. The official assignees were to be fects of the bankruptcy system had done only half their duty; they were also bound to show that the Bill provided a remedy, traders, or persons who had been traders. Now those who were traders would not be able to undertake the office, so that it administered, the only material thing for a bankrupt to consider was, his conduct before the Commissioners; if he dealt tolerably fair with them, all would go well with him. These were palpable defects which required remedy, and it was also necessary that the rights of creditors should be better secured and promoted, and that a more complete protection should be afforded to honest debtors reduced by misfortune. A Court was wanted, not alone for the benefit of traders, but for the management of the affairs of all persons who might happen to Bill which left all the anomalies and irregularities of the law precisely where it found them, and enacted places and pensions, fees and salaries. Such a Bill as this ought not to have been the first legislative measure of the master-mind of the age, who had been lauded in terms scarcely applicable to a human being. His chief objection to the Bill was, that it was a bar, an impediment to the liberal improvement of the law. He could not believe that the noble and learned Lord would expose himself to the suspicion of being actuated by motives which he knew the noble Lord would disdain, or afford a pretence for saying that this Bill was not intended for the amendment of the law, but for the creation of office—a measure of doubtful utility, but of certain expense would devolve upon those who had been traders; in other words, it would fall into the hands of jobbers. The office would be sought as a refuge for the destitute; it would be an hospital for incurables-a provision for decayed merchants; it would be the Lord Chancellor's lumber-room, into which he would cast whatever he despised as worthless. He could not help characterizing this Bill as a most busy, meddling, mistaken piece of legislation. A jurisdiction more liable to abuse, more liable to scandalous jobbing, he never knew. The hon. and learned Solicitor-fall into a state of insolvency. By rectifyGeneral had said, that the measure was ing these anomalies, the noble and learned a gain of the difference between 26,000l., Lord would really do what the Solicitorand 28,000. But it really took away the General thought he would accomplish by patronage of four places, and in lieu of it this Bill-erect a lasting monument to placed in the hands of the Lord Chancel- his fame. But this Bill was not the stuff lor the immediate, uncontrolled, and irre-of which monuments could be made; a sponsible patronage of 26,4001. If this expense was necessary, he (Mr. Pemberton) made no objection; but let them not be told of the Chancellor's making such a great sacrifice, when it put into the hands of the Great Seal a more enormous amount of patronage than was ever given to a subject of the realm. Though it might seem a strange argument for an Anti-reformer, he contended that the Reform of this Bill was too partial. The public had been promised by the noble and learned Lord, a revision of the law and of the Courts, and if that promise was fulfilled, there was no branch of the law in which the pruning-knife could be applied with so much benefit as the law of debtor and creditor. There was no lawyer who was not fully aware of the anomalies, irregularities, inconvenience, and injustice, produced by that and that he would permit it to be said. branch of our jurisprudence. It frequently that an attempt was made to force this pressed upon the honest and innocent, mass of undigested legislation through the and as frequently extended impunity to House, without an opportunity being affraud, and indulgence to crime. It filled forded it of examining and remedying its our gaols with beggars, and was in general defects; that the prorogation of Parliaas barbarous and absurd as any law that ment was delayed, and the Lords and ever disgraced a civilized community. The Commons of the land were to be kept most wealthy person in the land might be together at great inconvenience, in order made a bankrupt by the inadvertence or that the Lord Chancellor might have the carelessness of his servant, in giving a de- disposal of two score places six months nial of his master to a tradesman who sooner than he otherwise would. He did might happen to call at an inconvenient not insinuate this as a charge against the time. The law again made not the slight-noble and learned Lord; if he believed it est distinction between the fraudulent to be true, he would have asserted it, but he bankrupt and the victim of misfortune of those who had pursued a career of gross profligacy and extravagance, or those whom calamity had reduced to insolvency. By the law, as it was at present did not believe it; yet it was extremely difficult to understand on what ground this measure was attempted to be forced through the House at this season, when all minds were engrossed and absorbed by other topics. The hon. and learned | 1809. The Judges now to be appointed Member concluded by expressing his regret would be armed with all the powers necesif any expression had fallen from him sary to come to a conclusion in every case; which was intemperate towards the noble and examining the parties themselves, could form, from vivá voce evidence, much more satisfactory decisions than the best and learned Lord. of bankruptcy there was an immense mass Mr. Pepys said, that the motives from which the Bill had been supposed to ori-Judges from affidavits. In all instances ginate were those of saving labour to the Lord Chancellor, and increasing his patronage. But if the Court were useful, it was clear that it could not be established without patronage. No new Courts could; and yet they must be established, or there could be no improvement in the administration of justice. But if there was any one quality of the noble and learned Lord more remarkable than another, it was the readiness with which he undertook labour, and which was as eminent as the facility with which he got through it. Although the Bill might have the effect of relieving the Lord Chancellor from the pressure of bankruptcy business, it should be recollected that there was still an overwhelming mass of matter in the Court of Chancery, and that though one part might be relieved, much still remained. Another reason alleged for the Bill, but which his hon. and learned friend professed not to believe, was, that its object was patronage. Yet one would suppose that his hon. and learned friend meant this to be believed, for over and over again he had insinuated it, and the insinuation had been received with cheers. Those who cheered must have believed the charge, though his hon. and learned friend had given a conclusive Mr. Alderman Wood, being well acreason that the object could not possibly quainted with the feelings of the commerbe answered. The Bill, in fact, would cial interest of the city of London, would greatly diminish patronage in value. Its take it upon him to declare, that that ineffect was, to limit appointments to persons terest was deeply anxious that some meaqualified in a particular manner; they sure like the present, calculated to correct must be of a certain class. The noble and the abuses of our bankruptcy jurisdiction, learned Lord could not favour his friends should pass into a law. It was highly with the same latitude as former Chan-expedient that at least one commercial cellors, because the persons appointed man should be always on the list of offimust be of a certain class and qualification. cial assignees, as none other than mercanEver since he had been in the profession, he had heard the evils of the Bankruptcy Court complained of, and those evils this Bill would remedy. It was said, that the Judges would be paid before they had any work to do; that was a mistake. They would receive no salary till April, and in the mean time they would have many arrangements to make for the business of the Court. The separation of bankruptcy from the Court of Chancery had been recommended by Sir Samuel Romilly in This tile men could determine several practical questions between debtor and creditor. The only plausible objection which he had heard against the Bill was, that it would add to the patronage of the Lord Chancellor; but if it effected the good proposed, it was a matter of only secondary importance whether that noble Lord's patronage would be curtailed or extended. Mr. Sheil said, the objections urged to this Bill on the other side were all founded on its details, and did not touch the prin |