Senator REED. I can not pin you down to anything. Doctor FRIEDENWALD. I can not be pinned down to details, because I do not know details. I am thinking about the broad general principles. Senator REED. Yes; that is what I want to get you to do; the broad general principle whether it is within our right or desirable to give to the descendants of those Hessians quotas over the men who constituted that Continental Congress that decided to take them in. Doctor FRIEDENWALD. My answer to that, Senator, is in all deference, I would have to investigate statistics and be sure your statement is correct. Senator REED. We have the statistics here. Doctor FRIEDENWALD. But you know the old story about statistics? Senator REED. Yes; I know. Doctor FRIEDENWALD. Statistics, as you know, can be made to answer any purpose. Senator REED, Yes. Doctor FRIEDENWALD. And Doctor Hill and the statisticians will admit to you that the theories of the statistics do not rest on any exact scientific basis, like an exact science. Senator REED. Doctor, if you will pause for just a moment; the only statistics to which I was going to call your attention were the numerals in the table of quotas, which show that the German quota is very much larger at present than the British quota. Is it, in your judgment, fair to have the Germans and German element, the descendants of these Hessians you speak of, given a larger representation in the quota than the British? That is not any deduction from statistics. Doctor FRIEDENWALD. If your statement is correct-I am assuming it is-and it is based on correct statistical information. I do not want to listen to figures, Senator, because they do not mean anything to me Senator REED. Perhaps somebody else in the room does want to listen to figures and perhaps I want to give them. Under the temporary 1890 basis the quota of Germany is 51,227; the quota of Great Britain and northern Ireland is 34,007; that is, 51,000 against 34,000. Is that fair? Doctor FRIEDENWALD. If those statistics are correct, and I assume they are, then I do not see any reason why it is fair. I see no reason why there should be any discrimination in favor of Germans against English. That is all I have to say. I quite agree with you, if those statistics are correct. I presume they are as correct as they can be made. Senator REED. The statistics I read to you are the proclaimed quotas under which we are now operating, and until you suggested a doubt as to the accuracy of them, no one else has. Doctor FRIEDENWALD. It is not the first time I have had an individual opinion. Senator REED. Not at all. But those are the figures to which the immigration at present is limited. I am trying to find out whether in your judgement that is a fair system to continue. Doctor FRIEDENWALD. I can not answer your question. I do not know enought about it. Senator REED. Just to sum it up, then, Doctor, your personal opinion is that you do not believe in the literacy test; you do not believe in the numerical limitation of immigration; you do not know whether it is fair or unfair to give Germany a quota 50 per cent bigger than Great Britain and northern Ireland, and you do not know any method that you think is preferable to the national origins, but you do not like that. That summarizes your feelings? Doctor FRIEDENWALD. No; it does not in any way, shape, or form. I prefer to summarize my views for myself, if you want my views; and I have not stated anything along that line, and if I did, I did it by inadvertence. Senator REED. Where is the error in what I said, in that summary? Doctor FRIEDEN WALD. I said as to the literacy test that I had grave doubt of the efficacy of the literacy test, and my answer to you would be along that same line. I do not know, Senator, I am not prepared to state it. I said to you I have not enough information, and for that reason, I say that it is a most important question, important to every citizen of the United States. Now, if you, after studying all these years, have not determined that the present basis is correct, then let us all get together, all the people who are interested in immigration or want to restrict it or want to allow the bars to be lowered more than they are now, and see if there is not some basis on which we can come to an agreement or an understanding. Senator REED. Doctor, I have not the slightest doubt about it. I think the national-origins method is workable. I think it is fair, and I think it is high time it should be into effect. Doctor FRIEDENWALD. Then, I presume if you can convince enough other Members of Congress to agree with you, it will go through. As I said before, I think it is unworkable, and one of the principal reasons is this: it is so indefinite; it can be made to mean so much or so little, that after all, its operation will be in the hands of a group in the Department of Commerce, Department of Labor, or the Immigration Bureau. Now, then, I do not know but what some designing people might be able to influence, perfectly legitimately, by argument the man in charge of the interpretation and the operation of the law, to make it operate entirely differently from what it is intended by the men who enacted it. Senator REED. Have you seen the quotas they have tabulated in the report of 1928? Doctor FRIEDENWALD. I have seen them; that is all I can say. Senator REED. Can you point to any one of them that is not there or is incorrect? Doctor FRIEDEN WALD. No; I can not, sir. Because I have not examined them with sufficient care. Senator REED. I think that is all, Mr. Chairman. The CHAIRMAN. At this point I will put in the record various responses made by people who were sent invitations to be here, with views presented by those people. (The communications referred to are as follows:) Senator DAVID A. REED, Washington, D. C.: CHICAGO, ILL., February 5, 1929. Telegraphic advice from Senator Johnson, anent Committee on Military Affairs meeting, received too late for me to attend. Recognizing the inadvisability of further delay principally because of influx of Mexicans, I hope you will do what you can to urge immediate action. M. CONNOR, FREDERICK W. CHAPMAN. SAN FRANCISCO, CALIF., February 5, 1929. Secretary of Senate Immigration Committee, Washington, D. C.: I offer your committee individual plea for operation of national origins called for by immigration act as only plan suggested which insures to every eligible resident citizen or alien native born or naturalized, proportional representation in future blood current of our Nation. Claim that some foreign nation merits larger quota than origin gives is simply a demand on behalf that nation for more than its blood current this country and contemplates corresponding loss to other quota nations. Claim material inaccuracy seems untenable in view latest data and Doctor Hill's explantion, but in any event it loses force because of unavoidable inaccuracy in foreign-born quotas due to changes in map Europe. To repeal national origins and substitute a foreign-born basis would be in my judgment an injustice to every native-born citizen. And to further delay carrying out plain provision of law in absence of better reason seems unjustified. V. S. MCCLATCHY. Senator HIRAM W. JOHNSON, BOSTON, MASS., February 5, 1929. Committee Room of Military Committee, Washington, D. C.: Appreciate telegram. Illness prevents my attendance at public hearing. Again affirm strong stand of 8,500 Massachusetts Daughters of American Revolution for the present national origins provisions of immigration law. Mrs. JAMES CHARLES PEABODY, State Regent Massachusetts D. A. R. Hon. HIRAM JOHNSON, SACRAMENTO, CALIF., February 5, 1929. Chairman Senate Immigration Committee, United States Senate, Washington, D. C.: We are most grateful for your kindly telegram advising public hearings national origins. Our commission will be represented by Captain Trevor and Mr. Demarest Lloyd. IMMIGRATION STUDY COMMISSION. Hon. HIRAM W. JOHNSON, SAN FRANCISCO, CALIF., February 5, 1929. Chairman Senate Committee on Immigration, Washington, D. C.: Appreciate notice of public hearing on national origins provision of law, but not able to have representative present. Request statement made to committee that club held post-card referendum on principle, resulting 781 for national origins plan, 229 against. Regards. Hon. HIRAM W. JOHNSON, COMMONWEALTH CLUB OF CALIFORNIA, NEW YORK, N. Y., February 5, 1929. Chairman Senate Committee on Immigration: Acknowledge with thanks the courtesy of your telegram. The chamber will be represented at hearings beginning Wednesday. CHARLES T. GWYNNE. CHICAGO, ILL., February 5, 1929. Hon. HIRAM W. JOHNSON: NEW YORK, N. Y., February 5, 1929. HIRAM W. JOHNSON, House of Representatives: I shall be unable, because of an engagement I can not break, to attend hearing Wednesday. National origins means racial preservation. I hope national origins will prevail. JOSEPH LEE. LITCHFIELD, CONN., February 5, 1929. Hon. HIRAM JOHNSON, United States Senate: Telegram relative to Nye resolution received. National Society Daughters of Founders and Patriots of America desire to go on record as being vigorously opposed to any postponement or illumination of national-origins provision of immigration law; can not be personally present at hearing. Hon. HIRAM JOHNSON, Mrs. JOHN LAIDLAW BUEL. BOSTON, MASS., February 5, 1929. United States Senate, Washington, D. C.: During the last four years, some fifty or sixty thousand new foreign workers have entered Massachusetts. During the same period exceptional unemployment in Massachusetts has been continuous with consequent distress. The same conditions have existed in many other parts of the country. Under changed industrial conditions we have more than plenty of labor for our work and not enough jobs for our own people. Only a limited interest that wants peon labor is opposed to all-round restriction. If your committee will report out a bill cutting down all the larger quotas to 10,000 and limiting all countries whether East or West Hemisphere to the same number it will have the country's approval. The people are sick of racial controversies, and of the injection of foreign interests into our legislation and they want restriction. They want American jobs for Americans. The best way is to cut the Gordian Knot and give it to us while yet there is time. I can not attend hearing, but would say this if I were there. RICHARDS M. BRADLEY. The CHAIRMAN. Now, gentlemen of the committee, when do you want to resume? Senator REED. Saturday morning will be all right. Mrs. MINOR. I may not be able to be here at a later meeting. Mrs. MINOR. May I state I am here representing the Daughters of Founders and Patriots of America, a society of 25,000 women? We do not favor the Nye amendment. We do favor the national origins. The CHAIRMAN. Will you give your name to the reporter so that he may have it. Mrs. MINOR. My name is Mrs. George Maynard Minor, Waterford, Conn. The CHAIRMAN. We will now stand adjourned until Saturday morning at 10. (Thereupon, at 12.03 o'clock p. m., the committee adjourned, to meet Saturday, February 9, 1929, at 10 o'clock.) NATIONAL ORIGINS PROVISION OF IMMIGRATION LAW SATURDAY, FEBRUARY 9, 1929 UNITED STATES SENATE, COMMITTEE ON IMMIGRATION, Washington, D. C. The committee met, pursuant to adjournment, at 10 o'clock a. m., in the room of the Committee on Military Affairs, Capitol, Hon. Hiram W. Johnson (chairman) presiding. Present: Senators Johnson, Keyes, Reed, Gould, King, Harris, Copeland, Blease, and Stephens. The CHAIRMAN. This committee, now consisting of two members, will come to order; and I am going to say, for the sake of the record, unless more members attend these hearings I am going to summarily adjourn them this morning and conclude them. The hearings were called at the instance of those who favored the so-called Nye resolution and those who opposed it. The two who are present were probably the most open-minded of the members of the committee upon the subject, and neither the proponents nor the opponents of the resolution have attended in any very large numbers, and the two openminded members of the committee who thus far have attended will, as Senator Keyes agrees with me, unless the others come to our rescue, conclude the hearing this morning. Congressman Reece wishes to say something in respect to this resolution, and so, out of order, we will have you make that statement as you desire. STATEMENT OF HON. B. CARROLL REECE, REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF TENNESSEE Representative REECE. Mr. Chairman, as a representative in the other body, I am naturally interested in this question. But I am present this morning at the request of Judge Noyes, the representative of the Junior Order of United American Mechanics, to express the views of that order, in view of the fact that Judge Noyes himself is ill and could not be here. This order has a membership in the United States of some 400,000 thousand. The views of the members generally and of the officials of the Junior Order is that the national-origins clause ought to become operative as is now provided that it should not be repealed or the operation of this provision of the law extended. They are very much of the opinion that in the determination of our future citizenship that recognition should be given to the blood which has built America and American institutions and which has defended America at all times, and not be based upon the quota of aliens which might be residing in this coun 71 |