Senator KITTREDGE. What did Colonel Gorgas tell you regarding the conditions in his department?

Mr. MAGOON. That his organization was excellent. A little later he asked for two changes in the superintendents of hospitals at Ancon and at Colon. Although with respect to both of the men he spoke and wrote very highly as to their accomplishments and as to their ability in every way, he preferred other men of slightly different experience.

Senator KITTREDGE. I had not in mind the question of who were. to do the work, but what Colonel Gorgas told you regarding the difficulties, if any, he had had prior to the time you arrived there.

Mr. MAGOON. He said that the sanitary department had been hampered in the matter of delay in furnishing supplies, in the number of men which had been put at its disposal, and in the way of a general lack of facilities to do all that was required. I think a moment later, Mr. Senator, I will give you an illustration of what I mean.

Having had several conferences with Colonel Gorgas on these matters, I gave him personal assurance, and subsequently reduced it to writing, that to the extent of the Commission's ability he would have all of the means and men and money required to extirpate the diseases, more especially the yellow fever, and we then immediately proceeded to enforce ways and means.

The campaign is, first, to prevent the propagation of Stegomyia mosquitoes, and of course that includes all mosquitoes. I mean if you prevent the propagation of Stegomyia, you do of Anopheles and Culex also. Next, to prevent those that are propagated from becoming infected, and, next, to destroy the infected ones. That calls for drainage, for the making certain that there are not water containers of any kind, anything that will hold fresh water, especially sitting around the houses. The Stegomyia breeds in and about habitations. It does not breed in the swamps. To prevent mosquitoes becoming infected it is necessary to discover a patient as quickly as possible and to screen him, that mosquitoes may not get to him. The next step is to destroy the live mosquitoes, which is done by fumigation.

The fumigation of Panama and Colon had proceeded as had been found sufficient in Cuba; that is, the house in which a patient was and in which the disease developed had been fumigated, and the adjoining houses. The disease had appeared in many localities in the town of Panama, and fumigation had taken place in so many different parts that practically the entire town had been fumigated once, but it was spread over a period of practically of one year. It was decided to fumigate the town as a whole that is, to fumigate the town rather than the houses-and to complete the fumigation of the town in the shortest time possible.

Colonel Gorgas reported that he did not have sufficient facilities in the way of fumigating pots, and ladders, and paste pots, and things of that sort to conduct the work, and he made out a requisition for supplies of that class. I cabled to Washington asking for exactly what he had requested. Within forty-eight hours it was on the way, and upon arrival on the Isthmus the fumigation of Panama was entered upon.

Senator KNOX. What do you mean by fumigating the town rather than the houses.

Mr. MAGOON. I mean to take the town as the unit. I mean to go to work to fumigate the whole town; not taking this house and this house [indicating], or fumigating a few houses in different localities, but to sweep over the whole town.

Sentor KNOX. You mean fumigating a town by fumigating all the houses? That is what you mean?

Mr. MAGOON. Yes, sir.

Senator KITTREDGE. Had Colonel Gorgas made requisition for that material prior to the time you arrived?

Mr. MAGOON. I do not think he had; not in that form. I think that his requisitions had been cut down early in the administration of affairs.

Senator KITTREDGE. To what extent?

Mr. MAGOON. I could not tell you as to that, Senator. I think that when his first requisitions came, calling, for instance, for several tons of pyrethrum, or insect powder, it was not understood at first that he was going to burn it, but it was thought that it would be used as insect powder is ordinarily used, and I think that some of his first requisitions were cut down in that way.

Senator KITTREDGE. When were they made?

Mr. MAGOON. They were made, I think, along in July or August of 1904, when the disease first appeared. I think the first case was in July, 1904.

Senator KITTREDGE. To what extent had the conditions that you describe continued until your arrival, according to the statement of Colonel Gorgas?

Mr. MAGOON. The disease had not become epidemic, say not exceeding 7. 8, or 9 cases a month, until the month of May, 1905, when it jumped to 33.

Senator KITTREDGE. I refer, Judge Magoon, particularly to the failure to grant requisitions.

Mr. MAGOON. I do not think it would be accurate to say that there was a failure, meaning a complete failure. They did for a time exercise a sort of a supervisory right over the requisitions of the sanitary department, and would cut them down.

Senator KITTREDGE. Where was that done?

Mr. MAGOON. In Washington, I think.
Senator KITTREDGE. By the Commission?

Mr. MAGOON. Yes, sir; there were great quantities of fumigating material supplied. The colonel's-I ought not to say exactly complaint" the colonel's statement was that he had not been given the free hand which was essential.

Senator KITTREDGE. Did he state that it was essential that he have a free hand in the interest of sanitation?

Mr. MAGOON. Yes, sir.

Senator KITTREDGE. And that it had not been given him?

Mr. MAGOON. Yes, sir.

Senator KITTREDGE. Did he make any statement about the responsibility for that condition?

Mr. MAGOON. No, sir. The work had been progressing in accordance with the plan that had been adopted in Cuba, and the colonel was of the opinion that the requirements, as he saw it during the time, had all been complied with; that the epidemic did not result

from any failure of supplies, or from any failure of work by his department, but that his work had not been as extensive as it would have been had he been given the free hand.

Senator KITTREDGE. Did he make any statement about conditions if he had been given the free hand that he desired?

Mr. MAGOON. No, sir: nor do I think that the increase resulted from a lack of facilities being accorded to the sanitary people. It is one of the things that came. There came the epidemic, or a sufficient number of cases, so that I term it epidemic. Yellow fever is a mysterious disease; there is very little known of it, and it comes and goes. Senator MORGAN. Do you mean that it comes and goes whether people import it or not?

Mr. MAGOON. I suppose it must originate somewhere.
Senator MORGAN. I should think so.

Mr. MAGOON. And that it comes and goes in Panama is not surprising, because there are towns up and down the coast that are in communication with Panama, where it prevails practically all the time.

Senator MORGAN. Since the discovery of America by Columbus, Panama has been noted for its liability to epidemics of yellow fever, has it not?

Mr. MAGOON. Of course I do not go back quite that far, Senator, but it has been known up to recent times as being an unhealthful spot; yes, sir.

Senator MORGAN. It is mentioned by Humboldt as being the worst of all the locations in the world, except Aden, on the Gulf of Suez. About this matter of epidemics. I am extremely interested in it, because we have the question of quarantine up here, and that is one of the most important questions connected with this whole matter, as I understand.

Mr. MAGOON. Yes, sir.

Senator MORGAN. And I happen to be chairman of the committee. of the Senate that has that subject in charge, and I am anxiously inquiring for what is best to be done and what can be done. I suppose that you would state, in common with the other gentlemen who have testified here, that the quarantine against bubonic plague in the Isthmus and against yellow fever during the last summer was a serious obstruction to your operations.

Mr. MAGOON. Yes, sir.

Senator MORGAN. Those connected quarantines continued for over two months, did they not?

Mr. MAGOON. Yes.

Senator MORGAN. Over two months?

Mr. MAGOON. Yes, sir.

Senator MORGAN. For more than two months of last summer, then, the operations on the Isthmus were seriously obstructed by the quarantine against bubonic plague and yellow fever?

Mr. MAGOON. The operations of the transportation company.
Senator MORGAN. That is what I had reference to.

Mr. MAGOON. Yes, sir-of the railroad.

Senator MORGAN. Well, you can not get along there without free transportation both by rail and by water?

Mr. MAGOON. No; but so far as our work was concerned-that is, as between Colon and Panama-there was no quarantine. The trains moved continuously.

Senator MORGAN. I understand.

Mr. MAGOON. It was the quarantine which was made by the outside ports against La Boca.

Senator MORGAN. Cutting you off from access to outside ports?
Mr. MAGOON. Yes, sir.

Senator MORGAN. That was a serious detriment to the work?

Mr. MAGOON. Not to the work of canal construction, I take it.
Senator MORGAN. To your general operations there?

Mr. MAGOON. But to the operation of the Panama Railroad with reference to commercial business.

Senator MORGAN. All of these different instrumentalities connected with the construction of the railroad must move in harmony and upon a general system; otherwise they are all obstructed?

Mr. MAGOON. Well, yes; in large measure.

Senator MORGAN. Very good. Now, you say the yellow fever comes in a sort of a mysterious way into the Isthmus and it goes. Is it actually brought there by the importation of people in Panama who have yellow fever, or does it originate there?

Mr. MAGOON. It undoubtedly could be and has been brought there by people coming from other localities. Whether it originates there or not I am unable to say. Medical science does not know.

Senator MORGAN. Have the members of the medical fraternity down there ever devoted their attention to that question?

Mr. MAGOON. As to finding whether it originates there?
Senator MORGAN. Yes.

Mr. MAGOON. Not specially, to my knowledge; but generally, of course, they are investigating the entire subject.

Senator MORGAN. I think I may say that they have neglected the whole matter if they have declined to investigate whether yellow fever originated there, or whether it was necessarily imported, or did not get there if it was not imported. It originates somewhere. Their theory is that conditions exist there for getting into an epidemic condition in regard to the spread of the disease.

Mr. MAGOON. Do you mean conditions exist there now?

Senator MORGAN. They did before they commenced operations? Mr. MAGOON. Yes, sir.

Senator MORGAN. Yes. I think they exist there now as much as they did before; but they do not think so.

Mr. MAGOON. No: nor do I, Senator.

Senator MORGAN. It is all right for you to have that opinion, but I think I will come out ahead when we come to the final trial. Now, if a man is brought into the Zone with the yellow fever, and the stegomya abounds there, does not his presence, if he is exposed to the stegomya, necessarily create an epidemic condition of the disease within five or ten days in that Isthmus?

Mr. MAGOON. Will you pardon me if I ask you what you mean by the use of the word "epidemic?

Senator MORGAN. I mean the rapid growth of a disease, spreading from person to person.

Mr. MAGOON. As I understand it, the doctors use the word "epidemic" only to describe an existing situation-that is, when there are a large number of cases; but prior to that time the disease is present," as they term it.

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Senator MORGAN. Yes. I want to get at this: I believe that in our quarantine regulations in the Isthmus we must not wait until a large number of persons have become infected, and thereby an epidemic, as they call it, has been created; but when a case comes there, imported, I will say, from abroad, without respect to the place of the origin of the disease, and it is exposed to the stegomya, and they are supposed to exist in sufficient quantity to distribute it very rapidly, is it not true that within a period of five or ten days that locality ought to be considered as epidemic with reference to other countries?

Mr. MAGOON. It ought to be considered that there is danger of nonimmunes contracting the disease in that locality.

Senator MORGAN. Yes; it ought to be considered as an infected community?

Mr. MAGOON. Yes.

Senator MORGAN. The proposition that I have in mind, and which will serve to draw your attention to the particular point I want to bring out, is this-that in the Isthmian Zone or in Panama it is necessary to depart from the ordinary laws of quarantine in one particular. That is to say, to prevent the egress from that Isthmus of people going to other countries where the epidemic condition exists, or where the infected condition is probable from the fact that there are cases of yellow fever there that are being distributed by the stegomyia.

Mr. MAGOON. Do you mean people going from the Isthmus, or returning from such places to the Isthmus?

Senator MORGAN. Going from the Isthmus.

Mr. MAGOON. To localities where yellow fever exists?

Senator MORGAN. Yes.

Mr. MAGOON. They do not endanger the public health if they do not return, Senator.

Senator MORGAN. They do not endanger the public health there, but they endanger it everywhere else, at every place they go to.

Mr. MAGOON. Do you mean that a person going from the Isthmus of Panama should be debarred from entrance anywhere else?

Senator MORGAN. That is right; and they should be debarred from going out of that Isthmus because it is an infected district.

Mr. MAGOON. But I should say that the Isthmus of Panama is not an infected district now.

Senator MORGAN. Oh, I am not talking about now; I am talking about what it was in May, 1905, for instance, when you say yellow fever was epidemic there.

Mr. MAGOON. At that time I think that in the case of persons going to another locality where yellow fever could be propagated it would have been perfectly proper to have quarantined those people for the period necessary to demonstrate whether or not they had yellow fever. The yellow fever develops within seven days, and it is not a difficult matter to quarantine.

Senator. MORGAN. All nations that enforce quarantine laws do it for their own protection, of course; and they enforce it against persons entering their countries, not persons going out. Now, I think that in order to enforce international sanitation and justice, in order to protect humanity, when an epidemic of yellow fever exists in the Zone nobody who is exposed to it should be permitted to go away until he has passed through some regulation of quarantine which